Karen and I were connected through a local pastor here in Ontario who has been developing a ministry for small churches called Small Church Connections. She is the senior editor for the Evangelical Fellowship of Canada’s magazine Faith Today. I was privileged to do a podcast with Karen about the Flowers ministry this past winter.
She is also in the process of publishing her first book sharing about life as a pastors’ wife called The Minister’s Wife: a Spiritual Memoir due out by Tyndale in the spring of 2020.
It’s been a blessing to connect with Karen. Through our conversations I have sensed her heart for small- town pastors’ wives, having been one herself, and I think you will enjoy hearing the story of her life as a pastor’s wife..
Interview questions
Where did you grow up? How did where you grew up contribute to preparing you for life in small-town pastoral ministry?
I grew up in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia. Not much about my upbringing prepared me for pastoral ministry in any sized town. I’ve often thought I would have been voted “least likely to be a minister’s wife” in high school, if such a category existed. However, I did grow up in a family that was hospitable and interested in other people. I think that did help me prepare for the important work of listening and loving people, which I think is central to the work we do as women married to ministers.
Where have you served in ministry? Can you describe the particular culture in those areas and how that affected your ministry there?
We have been in big cities and small towns across Canada. My husband has served in Vancouver, Halifax, and Toronto, and in smaller towns like Meadow Lake, Saskatchewan, and Port Perry, Ontario.
We are now in a church in downtown Ottawa. Each place has its own culture, but we also have a “culture of the day” that is a very real thing in Canada, particularly right now. We are in a highly-secularized society, with so many options competing for the attention of everyone. It used to be weird if you didn’t go to church, now it’s weird if you do. Things have changed.
We need to be thinking about how we are as churches, how welcoming and loving we are, and how missional we are being in our communities for no reason other than to love as we have been commanded. It’s not an easy time to be the Church, but then again, when has it ever been simple? I do feel certain though, that whatever sized town we are in, or culture, we need to love more and better as the church.
How did God bring you to a place of serving in small-town/rural ministry? Did you have any sort of “calling” in this? If so, describe the circumstances.
We are not in a small-town setting now, but we have done that. When we lived and ministered in a small town, I saw and appreciated the close-knit nature of the Church, how the Church was so important to the town, and how the people were so important to each other.
Small churches in small towns are beautiful. They can do things big churches cannot do as easily. I am a city person, so I actually found adjustment to smaller town life and rural ministry very difficult. I had to grow to see the value of it, and my role in it. It was a humbling experience, and I learned a lot.
I have been reflecting recently on these things for a book I am writing for Tyndale House Publishers about being a minister’s wife as a matter of fact. Here is what I wrote about that time: “When you try to follow Jesus in your life long enough, paying our faulty kind of attention stretched out over years, you do see a pattern emerge of who knows best. Years ago, when we moved to the only place I said out loud that I did not want to live, I was perplexed that the Bishop who would say yes to Brent would be in that very place. I wondered why I had ever opened my big mouth, as we said back then. I hadn’t known then about the hardy friendships that grow out of prairie soil. I didn’t know how trees could be like gifts, or how vivid and alive flax and canola look, growing purple and yellow in neighbouring fields. I hadn’t yet had babies in hospitals where nurses give massages and husbands can come in late with a large greek pizza, and later that week you can see your doctor in the soup aisle, and he asks how you are feeling. I hadn’t canned ripe red tomatoes yet in my very own kitchen, with my own hands, pressing down on the silver lids to check for a good seal. I didn’t know that I would find myself a writer there, as well as a minister’s wife. It is not me who knows what is best, that I know for sure. I began to remember what I already knew, that God does know best and that I can trust Him, even when it is difficult and disappointing.
How did God bring you and your husband together to serve in this way?
Well, I married him and he became a minister. J Brent has always been clear, whenever we started at a new church that it was not a “two-for-one” deal. He assures the church that I will find my own way of serving, and I always do.
I am a writer and an editor, within the Canadian Church Press world, so our areas of work and vocation overlap beautifully, but they are still distinct. They do, though, feed into each other for sure.
Especially now when I am actually writing about being a minister’s wife, the overlap has never been so clear.
I always find my way to serve, but it’s very important to me that I do not get in other people’s way. For example, I used to help my husband with some writing and editing, but now he has an associate pastor who used to be a journalist, and she can help him very well with those things, so I have stepped away from that duty.
Each place and season is different, and God does make our paths of service clear I think. One thing I have learned is that God doesn’t just have something for Brent in the new town or city we are called to, He has something for me too. Our last move was very tough on our youngest son (he was halfway through grade 11 when we moved) and I assured him that God had his situation figured out as well. He never just calls the pastor. I have always found meaningful friendships, a way to love the place, and the right way to help out at the church, and to help my husband. As a writer and editor I have always worked from a home office so I’ve been able to grow in my writing life as well, through the years, through God’s beautiful grace.
Did you have any particular areas of ministry in which you served in your church and community and what led you to those decisions?
I have done every job at least once. Sometimes I have served out of the need that was in the Church, so, if they needed someone to set up for communion, for example, I would do that in an attempt to make life easier for my husband. That motivation does not always work I have found, because if it’s something I’m not naturally gifted toward, it’s just not a good fit. I can make things worse.
I love to teach Sunday School, and I’ve always done that. I do like to come up with creative ministry ideas and then work with a team to make them happen. That has happened in various ways in different places over the years.
I have served as a Meals on Wheels volunteer and I trained my dog to be a therapy dog so we could visit seniors in our broader community. I was convicted to serve outside of our church, so that my acts of service were not at all about making our church stronger (and therefore sometimes maybe about helping my husband more than actually having a heart of service), but about simply serving. That was a good exercise. In our last smaller town setting, before we moved to Ottawa, my husband and I launched a church-wide initiative to sponsor refugee families. We loved working together on that and the network is still strong. That was a great experience and showed us how much we can do when we work together, both he and I, but also the churches in the town. The church’s reputation is repaired when we love well.
What has been one of your greatest challenges in this ministry context and how did you persevere in it? What did God teach you through it?
We are fairly new where we are right now, just two years in, so the biggest challenge here so far has been finding my place. It is actually a larger church than we have been in for years, and Brent has a staff who is helping him do things that I might have helped with before. I realized that I could more freely decide who I wanted to be in this setting as a minister’s wife. I’m actually still meeting some people for the first time, so there’s been a level of anonymity that has been nice sometimes, and other times a little confusing for me. I realized I was accustomed to being more front and centre, so what does it mean to play less of an obvious role? I’m still answering that question. Our move coincided with my work doing a master’s degree that led to my book project about being a minister’s wife, so it has been a rich and reflective time to just attend church, instead of running church. To sit in a pew and not worry about details has been kind of lovely.
What has been one of your greatest blessings in this ministry context and how has that affected your perspective of small-town and rural ministry?
I think I’ve learned that there are hard things and good things everywhere. There is no perfect context. And each church and setting is full of surprises and twists, both happy and sad. I have personally found the life of church ministry to be difficult. Sometimes, even when I read things on this very site, I can feel a little badly that sometimes I’m not as content, or as at peace as some people seem to be. To me, it is a rewarding life, yes, but also a hard life. There have been times I have resented the church and the toll it can take on my husband. I’d love some free weekends. I’d like to not feel people are watching and evaluating.
So, to find the blessings has always been more work for me, and I wish that was not so. Learning the discipline of finding them though, is a good one.
If you could give a piece of advice to other rural and small-town pastors’ wives, what would it be and why?
I would say that the success of the church or your husband’s ministry does not rest on your shoulders. I would say, ‘relax and be yourself’ but also to know that there is a level of transparency that might lead to you being hurt sometimes.
I would say to focus on being a flourishing Jesus-follower, and if you have children, a flourishing mother, and that will make you a good minister’s wife and the companion in ministry your husband most needs.
I would say get away as a couple when you can, go on retreat with your husband if you are able. Protect your marriage, because it can be hurt by this life and all its demands and busyness. Find another minister’s wife to be friends with, someone to whom you can say anything and they won’t be shocked or appalled, but they will laugh with you and drink tea and give you a hug and you will know you are not alone.
Other info you might want to include:
I just think groups like this are so important. We need to support each other and reassure each other that we are not alone, and that it’s okay to be real. We need safe spaces. I’m so happy this is one.
